The CBE Scroll

Comment by Liz Sykes

April 29, 2006 @ 12:15 am

Our aim has always been to treat children and adults as people first, then their status in life (children or parents) and then gender specific. Maybe it was because we had 4 boys that we were determined to train them in right attitudes to one another and those around them (it was hard work) We got tired of people always saying “4 boys - what a handful - how do you manage etc.” It was like God found boys harder to deal with… then why did God make them like that ? We decided to treat our boys as fairly as possible given their different temperaments and a 5 yr gap between the first 3 (3 in 3 years) and the last one. People even said when we were expecting our last child “Oh well…now you’ll get your little girl” as though having a girl was a preferable thing. It is hard to live in a completely egalitarian manner because society and church culture almost demands otherwise.

Our sons are all grown now, three with children of their own and we’re pleased to report that for the most part they are egalitarian. We think their wives enjoy that too. They are endeavouring to bring up their boys and girls in a fair manner and look for their unique strengths and weaknesses regardless of gender.

As a couple, we have found that it’s a lonely road when you are truly egalitarian - you can’t take part in much of the joking and nonsense which happens even in church circles (maybe more ?). After 40 years, we are glad we’ve related to each other as Christians first, then male and female and it continues to be a wonderful adventure of discovery, sharing and mutual upbuilding.We’re far more bold in what we say about how we get on together than we would have been in earlier years. We got the usual comments about being “henpecked - under the thumb - can’t get along without your man ” and other unhelpful statements. It has caused us to examine the scriptures very carefully and are thankful for the wealth of great books available now to back up what we always felt in our hearts was right.

The benefits of holding to biblical equality within the family are seeing your kids grow up to appreciate people and recognise that there are all sorts of women and men and they’re all OK. It’s a great benefit when your husband or wife is your very best friend and you can share secrets with each other and feel affirmed in your very self. The challenge is to remain true to what you feel and not be pulled along with the mainstream church culture which makes jokes about men and women, husbands and wives, girls and boys. It’s achallenge to stand up and admit to having different convictions about these issues. It’s also a challenge to put these concepts out before your children and then see what they decide to do with them. For some it can take a while and even be a rocky road, but for the most part, they will go back to what they’ve observed in the home and appreciate it …in the long run!

Comment by Lori

April 29, 2006 @ 4:59 am

This is a complicated issue for us. I have been a supporter of the egal. position for several years now. Because my husband comes from Britain, though, where the idea of women in church leadership is accepted as normal, he had no idea that there was a conflict about the issue. He’s not really as passionate about the egal vs. comp. debate, just because, as I said, he doesn’t see the need to be! He’s seen countless women serving in church leadership with no ill effects, so why the need to make a big fuss about it (I must say that’s a very British reaction :) )? I’m the one who actively studies the issue, thanks in large part to CBE.

Therefore, when it comes to ministry, we’re pretty much an egalitarian family. Both my husband and I are certified as lay pastors with our denomination. In fact, he was the one who encouraged me to join the program because he thought I had the gift of preaching!

It gets more complicated, though, when it comes to our day-to-day married life. Now, we don’t put any emphasis on hierarchy in our marriage. He considers me as a partner. When issues, big or little, come up we discuss them and come to a mutually satisfactory conclusion. I can honestly say, like Gordon Fee, that there’s never been a time when I’ve grumbled and said, “Well, I guess we have to do it your way because that’s what the bible says.” There are times when I decide to go with his opinion, but again, I don’t think of it as “submitting because I have to.” I think of it more as “Well, let’s try this way and see what happens.”

And there’s been a couple of times, when major issues affected our marriage, that my husband went with my view on the matter. So, I guess that you could say we have an egalitarian marriage. My only hesitation about wholeheartedly saying we do is that, during one of these crises, when my husband eventually decided my solution was better, he said, “See? Being submissive doesn’t mean being a doormat. I’m so glad you had the courage to speak up. I really value that in our marriage.” So maybe, in his mind, he thinks of us as a tad bit complementarian. I don’t know. Like I said, he had never heard the terms “egal.” or “comp.” until I told him. He didn’t even know there was a debate. So I guess we’re kind of figuring this out as we go along.

Comment by Cecily Paterson

May 25, 2006 @ 8:33 pm

I grew up in an egalitarian household. The language of ’submission’ and ‘leadership’ was never used by my parents or extended family at all. I married a man who appreciated my gifts and was willing to learn from me and start out in an equal marriage. However, we live in Sydney, where the Anglican evangelical position is strongly complementarian and the prevailing Christian culture separates men and women at almost every opportunity.

I had never truly looked at the biblical data, almost for fear of what I would find - what if they were right? I didn’t know if I could cope. So I started to try to ’submit,’ to be that person who just goes along and doesn’t say much about it. But honestly, my marriage was miserable. Subconsciously, I grew to hate my husband because I felt that I could not be myself and have an opinion.

This year, I am a women’s Bible study leader at the prominent theological college my husband attends, and the materials we have been doing are entitled, ‘Women, God, and the Bible,’ so I really had to start learning much more about what and why I believed. Since I’ve done the work, I have felt so liberated to be able to operate as a real partner in my marriage, a real equal with worthy opinions. Things in our marriage have improved beyond belief. I am looking forward to the future!

Comment by Kathryn Vance

June 11, 2006 @ 11:20 pm

I am so glad for these forums in which people are bringing their unique God-given perspectives to each other. In Eph. 5:21, the Word illustrates exactly what I believe Cecily Paterson is saying about marriage: the Christ in my spouse submitting to the Christ in me, and vice versa. It actually destroys the hierarchy of male over female! The Word says that the Holy Spirit, not men, will guide us into all truth. When a woman must always be under the spiritual leadership of a man, the man has taken the place of the Holy Spirit in her life. This is almost too blasphemous to consider, and it underscores just how unscriptural the complementarian view really is. Headship does not mean leadership; it means source or origin. The picture is that of a husband and wife submitting to one another because the first woman originated from man and all men have since come from women. Kathryn