Comments on: To Speak or Not to Speak ? http://blog.cbeinternational.org/2007/03/to-speak-or-not-to-speak/ Blog voices from Christians for Biblical Equality Tue, 6 Jan 2009 01:34:08 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.7 hourly 1 By: Liz http://blog.cbeinternational.org/2007/03/to-speak-or-not-to-speak/comment-page-1/#comment-39671 Liz Sun, 15 Apr 2007 02:43:46 +0000 http://blog.cbeinternational.org/?p=123#comment-39671 What a great thought about 'radical' - it's not really used that way but I like it ! We have 4 sons (3 daughters in law) and it's encouraging that our boys have a good view of women and the two who are in Christian ministry are very stong on equality. Even in their age group (33-39) they are ostracises by some of their colleagues but thankfully they are seeing the issue more clearly and able to enunciate their beliefs. We are now doing all we can for those who are 'coming behind' and hopefully they will have an easier road than we have had in the matter of biblical equality for all. What a great thought about ‘radical’ - it’s not really used that way but I like it !
We have 4 sons (3 daughters in law) and it’s encouraging that our boys have a good view of women and the two who are in Christian ministry are very stong on equality. Even in their age group (33-39) they are ostracises by some of their colleagues but thankfully they are seeing the issue more clearly and able to enunciate their beliefs. We are now doing all we can for those who are ‘coming behind’ and hopefully they will have an easier road than we have had in the matter of biblical equality for all.

]]> By: joanna http://blog.cbeinternational.org/2007/03/to-speak-or-not-to-speak/comment-page-1/#comment-39584 joanna Fri, 13 Apr 2007 23:04:24 +0000 http://blog.cbeinternational.org/?p=123#comment-39584 I've written quite a bit within my denomination on egalitarian issues, enough so that the editor of some of the publications told me that some saw me as "that radical woman". I decided to take that as a compliment, particularly since radical means, 'from the root.' While I don't have any daughters of my own (only 3 sons), I realize that I speak most of all for my daughters in the faith. I’ve written quite a bit within my denomination on egalitarian issues, enough so that the editor of some of the publications told me that some saw me as “that radical woman”. I decided to take that as a compliment, particularly since radical means, ‘from the root.’ While I don’t have any daughters of my own (only 3 sons), I realize that I speak most of all for my daughters in the faith.

]]> By: Faith T http://blog.cbeinternational.org/2007/03/to-speak-or-not-to-speak/comment-page-1/#comment-37900 Faith T Thu, 05 Apr 2007 12:56:10 +0000 http://blog.cbeinternational.org/?p=123#comment-37900 I have struggled with speaking up/out too. It can hurt. Sometimes even a sense of shame follows for speaking out--"one must always be nice" goes the voice in my head. I find comfort in the story about the Caananite woman. She spoke up to Jesus about her need, at first he seemed unconcerned testing her, "saying it is not good to give the children's bread to dogs...but she came back with a rigorous response, "even the dogs eat the crumbs from the table." Then in a surprise ending, Jesus beams, addresses her and those listening, "woman you have great faith." Sometimes faith in is speaking up for the kingdom...because it is for us too. I think this story validates women who courageously claim the kingdom vision of freedom in Christ. I have struggled with speaking up/out too. It can hurt. Sometimes even a sense of shame follows for speaking out–”one must always be nice” goes the voice in my head. I find comfort in the story about the Caananite woman. She spoke up to Jesus about her need, at first he seemed unconcerned testing her, “saying it is not good to give the children’s bread to dogs…but she came back with a rigorous response, “even the dogs eat the crumbs from the table.” Then in a surprise ending, Jesus beams, addresses her and those listening, “woman you have great faith.” Sometimes faith in is speaking up for the kingdom…because it is for us too.

I think this story validates women who courageously claim the kingdom vision of freedom in Christ.

]]> By: Kathryn http://blog.cbeinternational.org/2007/03/to-speak-or-not-to-speak/comment-page-1/#comment-37814 Kathryn Thu, 05 Apr 2007 03:22:58 +0000 http://blog.cbeinternational.org/?p=123#comment-37814 Re:comment # 15: I've shared the testimony of my own journey from patriarchy to egalitarianism in another blog. It is always a blessing to read the testimonies of others and to know that we are not alone after all. Thank you cokhavim for that encouraging word! Re:comment # 15: I’ve shared the testimony of my own journey from patriarchy to egalitarianism in another blog. It is always a blessing to read the testimonies of others and to know that we are not alone after all. Thank you cokhavim for that encouraging word!

]]> By: Liz http://blog.cbeinternational.org/2007/03/to-speak-or-not-to-speak/comment-page-1/#comment-37789 Liz Thu, 05 Apr 2007 01:30:54 +0000 http://blog.cbeinternational.org/?p=123#comment-37789 Thanks for the points 1 & 2/ They are so true and surely God wants this great word to go out to many hurting, confused, innocent people so let's pray for more opportunities. I keep thinking of Elijah and the fact that there we hundreds of people who hadn't bowed the knee to Baal and yet Elijah felt all alone. Sometimes we need that sorft of encouragement directly from God or from him through his people like yourself cockhavim. Thanks for the points 1 & 2/ They are so true and surely God wants this great word to go out to many hurting, confused, innocent people so let’s pray for more opportunities. I keep thinking of Elijah and the fact that there we hundreds of people who hadn’t bowed the knee to Baal and yet Elijah felt all alone. Sometimes we need that sorft of encouragement directly from God or from him through his people like yourself cockhavim.

]]> By: cokhavim http://blog.cbeinternational.org/2007/03/to-speak-or-not-to-speak/comment-page-1/#comment-37716 cokhavim Wed, 04 Apr 2007 17:59:20 +0000 http://blog.cbeinternational.org/?p=123#comment-37716 I found it hard to speak out in the beginning when God first showed me egalitarianism. I was crippled by fear and pain. Fear: I was afraid of being labeled as feminist or unsubmissive or rebellious. I was afraid that nobody would agree with me and just view me as radical and not really walking with God. Pain: Whenever I did speak up, it was usually sarcastic and attacking because I was still hurting and angry about the hierarchical falsehood that I was taught and believed. Fast-forward about 3.5 years: God healed me of the pain and gave me gentleness and confidence when speaking for the truth. And the more I spoke, the more I found that more people were open to egalitarianism than I thought! A few months ago I was asked to teach a series of Bible studies about gender issues in the Bible and difficult passages, and it was a hit! The moral of the story: 1. you probably have a lot more supporters out there than you think. 2. God can turn past "failure" conversations into learning experiences for future ministry opportunities. I found it hard to speak out in the beginning when God first showed me egalitarianism. I was crippled by fear and pain. Fear: I was afraid of being labeled as feminist or unsubmissive or rebellious. I was afraid that nobody would agree with me and just view me as radical and not really walking with God. Pain: Whenever I did speak up, it was usually sarcastic and attacking because I was still hurting and angry about the hierarchical falsehood that I was taught and believed.

Fast-forward about 3.5 years: God healed me of the pain and gave me gentleness and confidence when speaking for the truth. And the more I spoke, the more I found that more people were open to egalitarianism than I thought! A few months ago I was asked to teach a series of Bible studies about gender issues in the Bible and difficult passages, and it was a hit!

The moral of the story: 1. you probably have a lot more supporters out there than you think. 2. God can turn past “failure” conversations into learning experiences for future ministry opportunities.

]]> By: Liz http://blog.cbeinternational.org/2007/03/to-speak-or-not-to-speak/comment-page-1/#comment-37515 Liz Tue, 03 Apr 2007 15:39:00 +0000 http://blog.cbeinternational.org/?p=123#comment-37515 Amen to all you said Jeanette. I actually wrote this piece more to create discussion than to express my own concerns and everything that has been contributed has been very helpful and confirming. My personal issue hasn't really been a hesitancy to speak out (unless as you say, the person is very set in their beliefs) but rather a concern for possibly alienating people once they know my position and so preventing further discussion. We agree with you that this is an issue of the full gospel of redemption in Christ which is so restricted in many circles - particularly those groups who claim to be concerned about biblical inerrancy and correct translations. Amen to all you said Jeanette. I actually wrote this piece more to create discussion than to express my own concerns and everything that has been contributed has been very helpful and confirming. My personal issue hasn’t really been a hesitancy to speak out (unless as you say, the person is very set in their beliefs) but rather a concern for possibly alienating people once they know my position and so preventing further discussion. We agree with you that this is an issue of the full gospel of redemption in Christ which is so restricted in many circles - particularly those groups who claim to be concerned about biblical inerrancy and correct translations.

]]> By: Kathryn http://blog.cbeinternational.org/2007/03/to-speak-or-not-to-speak/comment-page-1/#comment-37379 Kathryn Mon, 02 Apr 2007 20:38:46 +0000 http://blog.cbeinternational.org/?p=123#comment-37379 Re: comment #12: Thank you Jeannette. There is something so powerful about resting in the promises of God, about keeping those promises in our hearts-and in our mouths. The Lord honors that (Matt. 21:21, Mark 11:22-24, and Heb. 4). Re: comment #12: Thank you Jeannette. There is something so powerful about resting in the promises of God, about keeping those promises in our hearts-and in our mouths. The Lord honors that (Matt. 21:21, Mark 11:22-24, and Heb. 4).

]]> By: Jeannette http://blog.cbeinternational.org/2007/03/to-speak-or-not-to-speak/comment-page-1/#comment-37351 Jeannette Mon, 02 Apr 2007 12:47:36 +0000 http://blog.cbeinternational.org/?p=123#comment-37351 Liz, You are not alone. I can totally understand how discouraging it can be and have been there many times. One of the things that has helped me when I have come out of a difficult conversation that did not go so well is to focus on Christ and His call to proclaiming the gospel. Equality is not simply about "women" it is about the TRUE GOSPEL, that Jesus died to free us from the curse of sin and to create for Himself one Body where there is unity and equality in the diverse community of men, women, black, white, hispanic, asian etc. The enemy is alive and working to keep the gospel limited to the complementarian box because he knows that this hinders the advancement of The Kingdom. It hinders The Kingdom because gifted women are not allowed to express their God-given gifts and callings. But it also hinders The Kingdom because non-Christians can "smell" that there is something "unGod-like" in the complementary compartmentalization of men and women. (Understandably so!) So, when I feel defeated and beat down. When I wonder to myself, "Why speak up? Why put myself out there on the line?" I remember Christ and all that He has done for me. I remember the men and women that have gone before me to sacrifice for the gospel...and somehow I come to see that the road I have been asked to walk in this 21st century, though hard, is light in comparison to the persecution others have endured for the gospel. We all need wisdom and discernment for timing of when to speak and whom to engage in conversation. If I know that someone is prejudiced and unopen to exploring the Bible for further truth in this area then I won't waset my time. We must be careful to not get ourselves entangled in unproductive arguments. We must do the best we can to conduct ourselves in a Christ-honoring manor as we seek to proclaim the truth of the gospel. But we must also not lose sight that this issue at the heart is The Gospel. Jesus died for our freedom! Keep your sights on Christ. He is your leader. He has blessed you with EVERY spiritual blessing in the heavenly relms.(Eph 1:3) And He has called and commissioned you to proclaim the gospel. (Matt. 28:19-20) There is strength and healing for the discouraged heart when we sit at the feet of Our Lord. Today, may He strengthen and encourage every discouraged heart whose true desire is to advance the gospel! Liz,
You are not alone. I can totally understand how discouraging it can be and have been there many times.

One of the things that has helped me when I have come out of a difficult conversation that did not go so well is to focus on Christ and His call to proclaiming the gospel. Equality is not simply about “women” it is about the TRUE GOSPEL, that Jesus died to free us from the curse of sin and to create for Himself one Body where there is unity and equality in the diverse community of men, women, black, white, hispanic, asian etc.

The enemy is alive and working to keep the gospel limited to the complementarian box because he knows that this hinders the advancement of The Kingdom. It hinders The Kingdom because gifted women are not allowed to express their God-given gifts and callings. But it also hinders The Kingdom because non-Christians can “smell” that there is something “unGod-like” in the complementary compartmentalization of men and women. (Understandably so!)

So, when I feel defeated and beat down. When I wonder to myself, “Why speak up? Why put myself out there on the line?” I remember Christ and all that He has done for me. I remember the men and women that have gone before me to sacrifice for the gospel…and somehow I come to see that the road I have been asked to walk in this 21st century, though hard, is light in comparison to the persecution others have endured for the gospel.

We all need wisdom and discernment for timing of when to speak and whom to engage in conversation. If I know that someone is prejudiced and unopen to exploring the Bible for further truth in this area then I won’t waset my time. We must be careful to not get ourselves entangled in unproductive arguments.

We must do the best we can to conduct ourselves in a Christ-honoring manor as we seek to proclaim the truth of the gospel. But we must also not lose sight that this issue at the heart is The Gospel. Jesus died for our freedom! Keep your sights on Christ. He is your leader. He has blessed you with EVERY spiritual blessing in the heavenly relms.(Eph 1:3) And He has called and commissioned you to proclaim the gospel. (Matt. 28:19-20)

There is strength and healing for the discouraged heart when we sit at the feet of Our Lord. Today, may He strengthen and encourage every discouraged heart whose true desire is to advance the gospel!

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