The CBE Scroll

Comment by Sara P.

August 3, 2009 @ 5:58 pm

Don’t wait — she can understand a lot at 10. Tell her now, and keep telling her over and over.

Comment by Diane

August 3, 2009 @ 10:07 pm

It breaks my heart when I hear about girls going through this early sexualization of their body. We recently had a sleepover for the female youth at my church to talk about body image and how we’re all created in the image of God. It’s an issue that we need to be talking about all the time.

There are two secular resources that I think can be used and applied by Christians in helping girls who are growing up in a difficult era to love their bodies as God created them:

First, the book “The Body Project: An Intimate History of American Girls” by Joan Jacobs Brumberg. This feminist author concludes that contemporary girls need inter-generational groups of women as their support system—exactly what the church could and should be offering. Along the way to this conclusion, Brumberg offers entertaining and insightful commentary into how society’s changed in its treatment of the female body from pre-Victorian times to today.

The second resource that I offer is the website http://about-face.org/ It helps people to become more responsible media consumers, particularly around issues of women’s body image and eating disorders.

I know that most of us who follow the CBE Scroll have plenty of church-related resources, so I offer these as supplementary material!

Comment by jlp

August 4, 2009 @ 9:12 am

In this little girl’s mind the worst thing a female can be is overweight and unattractive. Two days ago I had an opportunity to talk to her about this, using myself as the example. At that time she refused to believe me. I hope to tell her more as time goes on, whether she believes me or not. At least I will have planted a seed.

This child wants attention so much. She sees the world giving a lot of sexual attention to slim pretty women. I think she thinks if she dresses like those women, and is as attractive as those women, she will get the attention she wants.

I think that is the big problem for girls. All humans want attention, and girls see all the attention going to the sexually attractive women. They also see these women being valued as being more important than average women. They want that kind of attention and they want to be valued as being important. So they make it their goal to be sexually attractive.

Comment by jlp

August 4, 2009 @ 9:14 am

Thanks for the link!

We need to start educating girls that the cultural message that their value is in their sexual attractiveness to men has its basis in male sexual addiction.

We need to start educating girls also about the effect of male sexual addiction on females.

Comment by Crayon Christian

August 4, 2009 @ 9:45 am

Boys in our culture are taught that the girls with prettier faces are more valuable than girls with average or less than average faces. They are taught that girls with large breasts are more valuable then girls with small breasts, and that girls with small waists and large hips are more valuable than girls without them. They are also taught that having sexual relations is the most important thing in life, and that they should attain it anyway they can.

We must not limit ourselves to re-educating girls. Girls are in part not just responding to the media, but to the way many boys treat girls. Some of the talk among boys derides less attractive females. Girls early on become aware of this. In addition, girls go to the beach and see boys paying attention to the more scantily clad girls.

Boys in our culture are taught that their worth as human beings is determined by how many sexually attractive women they have in their lives. The more sexually attractive females they attract, the more worth they have as a human being.

Not all boys have these beliefs, but most boys have at least some of these beliefs. The problem with teaching boys that these values are not real values is that we come up against the porn industry. And the porn industry is powerful in this country. They stand to lose enormous sums of money if boys are taught to value girls humanely.

Comment by Crayon Christian

August 4, 2009 @ 11:21 am

Girls think dressing seductively is just meant to attract boys, boys think girls dress seductively because they want to have sex with boys.

This is a misunderstanding that needs to be explained to both girls and boys.

Comment by jlp

August 4, 2009 @ 5:13 pm

Today I told the little girl that I am overweight, or shall I say “fat.” She replied with “NO, NO YOU ARE NOT! YOU AREN’T, YOU AREN’T, YOU AREN’T!” I told her that I wanted to lose weight for my health but that my weight didn’t stop me from being happy. I don’t think she understood me, but perhaps someday she will.

I still haven’t broached any sexual topics with her. She is too young.

Comment by Lin

August 4, 2009 @ 7:17 pm

“Boys in our culture are taught that the girls with prettier faces are more valuable than girls with average or less than average faces. They taught that girls with large breasts are more valuable then girls with small breasts, and that girls with small waists and large hips are more valuable than girls without them. They are also taught that having sexual relations is the most important thing in life, and that they should attain it anyway they can.”

The whole ‘pink and blue’ gender distinction focus outside of physical differences really adds to this problem. Girls are like this and boys are like that mentality. Each gender group thinks these presupposed distinctions of emotion, tastes and intellect is what is socially acceptable and they adapt to them. And if they don’t they are ‘odd’.

Girls are taught both in the secular world and the church they are to please men. In the secular world it is about sex appeal and self gratification. In the church it is about self gratification for men.

Girls learn eventually not to be smarter than boys if they want them to like them. This is reaffirmed in the church. So her value must come from her looks.

A big step in the right direction for my daughter was to not have a TV in the house from day one of her birth. She will still see it at other people’s homes but the focus of the commercials and shows seem strange to her. And she is not so desensitized to it that she asks questions about what she sees.

It is also good to have them in a private school that does not do popular culture, if you can find one. That also makes a big difference. For one thing, popular culture fads are idolatry. We do a disservice to our daughters to reinforce the culture fads. I ignore them unless they come up. And they rarely do because she would rather be collecting rocks and playing with animals.

I have an 8 year old daughter who thinks the Hannah Montana craze is silly. And she has never even watched the show! She sees her merchandise in stores and once asked me how much money she gets for all that stuff. We talked about the fact that Hannah should pay her for advertising her show if she wore her clothes.

Comment by jlp

August 4, 2009 @ 8:34 pm

This little girl does see shows on TV in which women’s sexuality is exploited. I think that is a big part of the problem.

Comment by jlp

August 4, 2009 @ 8:36 pm

I want to explain further my desire to lose weight. The first reason is for my health. And the second reason is that I would like to look better – but not for the purpose of driving men wild. But rather because I would like the way I looked better.

But I know that if I don’t lose weight, I will still continue to have a lot of happiness. Being overweight is not taking that away from me.

Comment by jlp

August 5, 2009 @ 10:20 am

Girls should be told that when they attract a boy through seductive clothing, that the boy is not going to put all his attention on her. If another girl comes along whose body he also likes, he will give her attention also. In fact, his mind is probably going to travel all over the young female universe. Girls should be told that you cannot get a boy who is going to be faithful to you through seductive clothing. That boy’s first priority is attaining access to female body parts wherever he can get them.

Girls should be told that if a boy likes them because of their personality, it’s more likely that he will be faithful.

Comment by em

August 5, 2009 @ 12:25 pm

The effects of pornography are growing and thus contributing negatively in regard to women’s vulnerability to sexual harassment and abuse. The time has never been more appropriate than now to address this. The evidence reveals that the prevalence of the problem of pornography reflects that society has an unhealthy view of sex and the objectification of women is increasing. David G. Myers author of Psychology through the Eyes of Faith explains the “exposure to non-violent sexually explicit films can make rape seem a trivial crime- moreover, viewers tend to become accepting of promiscuity, extramarital sex and women’s sexual submission. David Myers maintains “If we care to see women as equals rather than as servants to men’s sexual imagination, then pornography has demonstrated ethics that are somewhat less than wonderful.” Dallas Willard in the Divine Conspiracy maintains the New Testament very graphically speaks of those who have eyes of adultery (2 Pet.2:14). These are people who when they see a sexually attractive person, do not see the person but see themselves engaging sexually with him or her- they see adultery occurring in their own imagination. Willard insists this should and can be avoided by choice. The ramifications of the present culture’s attitude toward women- which has reflected unhealthily in pornography – need to be explored since much is happening by means of secular humanism that challenges the traditional understanding of what a marriage and family should be. That the church is becoming more and more patriarchal in its antithesis to culture is also problematic to women’s issues and concerns. The church, rather than confront culture seems to instead be conforming to the stereotypes the world offers. Letty Russell reminds us that in contrast, the gaze of the church must constantly be focused on changing the hierarchal and patriarchal structure of society and not simply setting up a new set of oppressors.” The task at hand therefore includes the “correction of the exclusionary results of past theories which have not prevented gender privilege.” Jack and Judith Balswick maintain that these are necessary undertakings since the Pauline Epistles as well as what Jesus said and did in his relationship with women points towards a “redeemed vision between men and women in which justice, righteousness and recovery of the cultural mandate might prevail.” A balanced commitment will also be reflected in the view of sexuality. Margaret Farley in ‘ Just Love’ provides a welcome perspective on Christian sexual ethics. While the secular world maintains that sexual relations are appropriate between ‘two mutually consenting adults,’ a view which is also reflective of enlightenment individuality. Farley, while correctly upholding that biblical sexual relations are between a male and female, she reaches beyond this ethic by adding that it is inappropriate for a slave owner to have sexual relations with a slave or servant and therefore it is also inappropriate for a man to have intimate relations with his wife if he has power over her, for this intimate act is not mutual if one partner is subservient to the other.
There are males that believe that women are subordinate- this may or may not have implications as far as intimate relations between a husband and wife. One cannot but help see parallels to the prevailing culture, perhaps we the church are viewing women dimly through our cultural lenses which are fogged up by pornography which corresponds to subservience of females to males.

Comment by jlp

August 5, 2009 @ 1:27 pm

What disturbs me is that female sexual submission and female sexual seduction is being glorified to little girls, such that they feel they must engage in it in order to obtain happiness. In other words, girls are being trained by our porn saturated culture to allow themselves to be used as sexual objects by males.

In addition to this, males are learning that the greatest happiness in life is from sex. Things such as playing with a child, having personal and intimate relationships with others that don’t involve sex and helping others are not portrayed as things worthy of living for. Only sex is worth living for.

I know the definition of sexual addiction encompasses a wide range of opinions. But when sex becomes the main thing in life to live for – you are missing out on the whole range of human experiences that can bring joy to life. If sex is the most important thing in someone’s life, then I personally consider them addicted. This is a much broader definition that others have.

Some people in the mental health field don’t seem to think it is a problem for men to put sex first in their lives or for little girls to want to grow up to be sex objects. I think a lot of denial is going on because so many men have become emotionally dependent on sex. Instead of dealing with pain, rejection and hurt in a way that helps them to grow – they use porn to distract themselves from these feelings. And in the process both males and females lose.

Comment by jlp

August 5, 2009 @ 1:28 pm

One cannot but help see parallels to the prevailing culture, perhaps we the church are viewing women dimly through or cultural lenses which are fogged up by pornography which corresponds to subservience of females to males.

I’ve thought about this also.

Comment by Crayon Christian

August 6, 2009 @ 10:05 am

Our media is teaching our girls that it is glamorous and exciting for them to be treated like sex objects by men and boys. This encourages girls to allow boys and men to do things to their bodies that they would otherwise never allow. The media is encouraging girls to be parties to their own sexual victimization.

Comment by jlp

August 7, 2009 @ 9:55 am

I’m not saying that men and women shouldn’t dress in an attractive manner for the opposite sex. But when girls feel they have to dress in a seductive manner, that’s when there is a problem.

Comment by Hope

August 10, 2009 @ 8:11 am

When I read of a ten-year-old girl seeking male attention, I have to wonder where her father is and whether he’s spent enough time with her and told her he loves her. If he were to remind his daughter on a regular basis that she’s a wonderful girl and that he loves her as she is, chances are she will not do inappropriate things to attract males. There are no guarantees, of course, but it’s worth a try.

Instead of talking with the girl, could you perhaps talk with her father?

Comment by jlp

August 10, 2009 @ 11:00 am

The father spends a lot of time with the little girl and is very alarmed by her attraction to wearing skimpy clothes.

He lets her know that he loves and that she is special. He is scared because he knows she does not understand the sexual content underlying the way she wants to dress. He has asked his wife to talk to her about it when she gets old enough. But I think her mother is too embarrassed to do it.

I deal with 7th grade girls all the time who have very involved fathers who really love them. They are still attracted to dressing sexually. Father involvement and love does not seem to affect the desire of little girls to gain attention through sexual dressing. At least in my experience as a 7th grade resource teacher it doesn’t.

Comment by jlp

August 10, 2009 @ 11:04 am

Her father does not use pornography, does not stare at women who are dressed seductively and is totally dedicated to his family. He is one of the best husbands and fathers I know.

He is scared for his daughters because he sees how the culture around him is glorifying women as sex objects.

I wish I could say that father involvement keeps a little girl from being attracted to this sort of teaching, but as a teacher I see differently. Perhaps parents need to explain more details to girls. Perhaps parental embarrassment has kept them parents from doing so.

Comment by Crayon Christian

August 10, 2009 @ 12:35 pm

It is not enough to encourage girls to love themselves as they are when the culture around them tells them their value is based on their sexual appeal. We have to discuss the underlying male sexual addiction that is driving this message. We have to let girls know that this message is not based on reality, but on delusion.

I agree that a Father’s love helps a girl deal with this distorted message. But it is not enough, it has to be combined with frank and candid discussions of unhealthy male sexuality.

Comment by jlp

August 10, 2009 @ 1:44 pm

In the 19th and early 20th century, warfare was glorified to boys in some parts of Europe and the United States. Many young men bought into this lie and went off to war, where they were multilated or killed. The delusion of the greatness of war destroyed their lives. I’ve often wondered if part of the reason war was glorified was for the purpose of conning young men into giving up their lives so that the rich could get richer. Many of these wars were imperalistic in nature. They were not defensive.

Theodore Roosevelt bought into the lie about the glory of war, and off he went into the Spanish American war. Later he encouraged his sons to get involved in WWI. His youngest son died in the last days of that war. Perhaps then he realized war wasn’t as glorious as he thought it was.

World War I ended the delusion of the glory of war. Veterans shared the horror war in books and novels. And war was no longer gloried to boys.

I wonder if that isn’t what is happening today in the media. They show young women eager and happy to be used as sex objects. They readily display their bodies to attract men, and oh how glorious it all is! Perhaps if women and men faced the truth about the male sexual addiction and its effects – the media would stop promoting the sexual objectification of women.

Comment by Hope

August 10, 2009 @ 4:49 pm

This is scary. Our daughter is ten and has thus far shown good judgment in what she wears. But clearly we need to be vigilant.

Comment by jlp

August 10, 2009 @ 8:13 pm

Perhaps your daughter won’t have this problem. This little girl has had this problem since she was about 6 years old. It’s lucky that she has the family that she does, because they are concerned about it.

And if she does develop this problem, perhaps talking to her at appropriate times throughout her teenage years will help her avoid this problem.

Comment by Amanda B

August 10, 2009 @ 11:45 pm

I agree that we need to teach our girls not to stake their identity on their sexual attractiveness to men. It’s vastly important for them to be confident in who they are and where their value truly lies.

However, I believe this can only be accomplished as they begin to see a) Who God is, and b) what He says about them. If a little girl can really get her heart around the idea that the most majestic, glorious, fascinating Being in the universe deeply loves her and views her with dignity and honor, suddenly the guys at school don’t seem quite so important. If she really believes she is beautiful to God (and thus, beautiful in truth) because of the sum of who she is — her physical body, yes, but also her personality, her emotions, her intellect, her sense of humor, etc. — then she will be less inclined to throw herself at anyone who looks twice. If she becomes deeply enamored with the One who gave her everything, she will not be impressed with a sex-crazy society that wants to take everything from her.

Girls loving themselves in the Lord is critical to their resisting the call of our fallen culture. However, they can only love themselves inasmuch as they realize God’s love for them, and that only matters to them inasmuch as they know how amazing God is in the first place.

Comment by Liz

August 11, 2009 @ 6:10 am

I once heard a well-known Christian speaker say that one of the reasons he turned to homosexuality in his youth was that he observed that in films, the attractive women got all the attention. Interesting that he was able to recognise this, even from as young as 6 years old.

Comment by jlp

August 11, 2009 @ 7:51 am

In response to Amanda’s post I want to share this story. Years ago I was talking to a woman who was enormously overweight. So much that I was afraid for her life. She was a new Christian. She told me that she was having experiences with God. In these experiences she felt God’s love. What she couldn’t understand was why God loved her because she was fat.

I had never thought that God might not like someone because they were overweight. That thought had never entered my mind. So I struggled to find ways to tell her that being overweight had no effect on God’s love for her. But nowadays I realize I didn’t have to do that. The very fact of her experiencing God’s love would someday make it quite clear to her that her weight did not keep God from loving her.

Comment by jlp

August 11, 2009 @ 1:12 pm

I feel sad that the media had that effect on that speaker. I never thought the media would affect a boy in this manner.

In the media we always see the successful man getting the sexually attractive women. I have always thought that this misleads boys into thinking that in order to be successful they must always have a seductive woman by their side.

I never imagined that it could make a boy feel bad about being male.

Comment by Liz

August 11, 2009 @ 3:29 pm

The films weren’t the only contributing factor to this man leaning toward homosexuality but he made a point of emphasising it as something he observed at a young age.

Comment by jlp

August 11, 2009 @ 8:44 pm

Thanks for clarifying that Liz.

Comment by Robyn

August 12, 2009 @ 3:39 pm

I think a 10-year-old girl is “old enough” NOW. If we wait until our daughters are teenagers to start talking to them about sex, sexuality, and their bodies it will be too late. They will have already internalized all the messages that this girl’s parents are so afraid of. As a public school teacher, I can tell you that the average 10-year-old (5th grade) already knows far more than we would like.

We do have a television in our home, but we do not have any channels. We only watch dvds that we approve, no commercials, no “accidental” viewing of inappropriate content. My daughter is 3, but I still talk to her about what is appropriate in various areas. I don’t see why sexuality and clothing should be exempt. I do anticipate that this battle will become more difficult once she starts school, however.

Comment by jlp

August 13, 2009 @ 8:49 am

The parents of the little girl do not want her to know much about sexuality yet, so I’m careful what I say.

I wonder what I would do if I had a little girl myself? I have no children so I don’t know from experience how I would teach them about sexuality.

Comment by Robyn

August 13, 2009 @ 9:52 am

But she ALREADY DOES know, obviously, even if that knowledge is subtle. Evidence: she tries to emulate the sexuality of women/teens by dressing and acting provacatively. I understand you can’t overstep the parents, but I really think they are making a mistake by attempting to shield her and not discussing outright what has already obviously manifested iteself in their daughter’s behavior. Ignorance is not protection. Obviously, that’s just my opinion as a parent and a high school teacher. I’d love to know how their strategy plays out 5 years from now.

Comment by Robyn

August 13, 2009 @ 9:54 am

Plus, they are doing her a GREAT disservice by allowing her to access the sexualized content you describe (as in the video game and tv/movies) without ever discussing it with her. OF COURSE she is going to internalize it. What did they expect? This is a direct contradiction to their stated (by you) desire that she not know about sexuality yet.

Comment by jlp

August 13, 2009 @ 10:07 am

I’m not sure when they are going to talk to her. They are from another religion and another country. I think being in the United States has made them aware that they must talk to her sooner than they would have in their country of origin.

I know that their cultural background, which is from a third world country, keeps knowledge about sex from children as long as possible. I know they have reached the conclusion that in living in the United States that this is not possible. This is a big cultural jump for them.

Her mother has gone online to get ideas on how to deal with this. And both her parents have expressed their desire to her to not dress in a sexual manner.

All her extended adult female family members dress modestly because of their cultural and religious background – even though they live in the United States. However, one of her female cousins is having the exact same problem this little girl is. And I suspect her parents aren’t happy with it either.

Someday I wish some psychologists or other child experts that could put together material that parents could use to talk to their daughters about this. I think a lot of parents don’t know how to do this.

Comment by jlp

August 13, 2009 @ 10:11 am

Yes, I think it would help her immensely not to view American television or movies in which women are glorified when they act as sex objects.

I once caught her watching a movie from her native land in which about 20 young women in bikinis were all trying to get the attention of one man. I asked her to turn it off. Later she told her mother about it, and said I was too old fashioned.

Comment by jlp

August 13, 2009 @ 10:15 am

One more thing – I was shocked to find a movie with this kind of content from her native land, since the women don’t dress in a sexualized manner there. Here mother showed some TV shows from that country, and I almost fainted. Young women were sexualized and glorified in their media as much as they are in the United States.